This is pretty unconvincing support of Starmer, basically reject the reform party, stick together and be optimistic about the economic future. She lists the bad things that have happened over the last few weeks and things that happened to the middle class and instead of making these foundational they were largely ignored as well as the legitimate grievances of the people supporting the reform party. Now I am not really familiar with the political issues in Great Britain except at a very high level but at the very high level Starmer’s speach sounds a bit like what I have heard in liberal/ progressive speaches. In the US and those fell very flat with the working people.
Gah. This is awful. Labour makes the Democrats look good and the Tories do the same for the GOPe. Delusional hack didn't notice that Stamer's landslide attracted fewer votes than Cobryn's wipeout. Heck of a job winning back the working class. Memo to TLP. Don't take advice from these fools.
Any saving of Great Britain REQUIRES power going to the national populists... aka the center working and middle class... and taken away from the upper class elites.
Yes, but populism and nationalism must also be disciplined by the guard-rails of liberalism. (as in 'liberal democratic norms', not as in progressivism)
Indefinitely pushing in the direction of right-wing populism without any guiding liberal principles has never worked out well for anyone, the working and middle classes most of all. Last time Europe tried it, it resulted in two World Wars, the decimation of every Western country sans the U.S., and the gruesome deaths of millions of people.
I don't think that's something that will be of any benefit to the working or middle class.
And the French Revolution is another good example of populism going very wrong . And that did not even require a head of state to make it happen That doesn’t mean the underclass did not have very legitimate grievances, they did but grievances not addressed and then exploited for power with no legal restraints and personal liberties respected ends badly
I have a very hard time even attempting to understand politics from a country that arrests 30 people a day because their speech has offended someone. People here who have business in England have to be careful of what they say on Twitter here because they could get arrested there.
Sounds like the working class in England has no party to represent their interests. Glad we revolted from that poxy island.
The lack of free speech is very disconcerting , but it pales in comparison to tolerance for the systematic rape of children. The West is only 15% of the world's population. Until recently we had very specific beliefs that separate us from the other 7 billion people on the planet.
In the West, first and foremost, we protect women and children, at all costs. That is not the case in most of the rest of the world, even if other non Western nations bother to pay lip service to the idea. We demand equal rights for all. Women are not chattel. Jews, historically chastised and abused all over the globe, have been safer in the US than anywhere else, but Israel. The LGBTQ community does not fear physical attack or a lack of rights in the West.
Until recently, free speech, unknown in the vast majority of the rest of the world, was a cornerstone of Western values. Now as the mess in England clearly demonstrates, Western values are at risk of disappearing. If they do so, at the alter of multiculturalism, they will not be returning anytime soon, anywhere on the planet.
The notion that England must be saved from Populists, is sadly amusing to anyone who has watched the changes in the nation over the last few decades. More than a decade ago, we arrived in London to stories of an English Judge who refused to imprison a newly arrived Muslim migrant for raping a 13 year old girl, because the migrant was unaware sex with children was a crime.
I remember it vividly because I did not believe it, when we first heard the story. We were living in CA at the time, and I remember thinking not even San Francisco lunatics would abide such a travesty. This was long before there was any reporting on the grooming gangs and mass rape of poor English girls by Pakistani men or Brits watched Jews executed on their streets, on the most sacred Jewish day of the year.
Starmer has an 18% approval rate. More than 80% of English voters want him gone. Some diseases are more popular. The last time Western voters had that much buyer's remorse, Biden was sitting in the WH and 5-10K migrants a day had been streaming across the Texas border, for the better part of 2 years.
Perhaps Starmer will limp along with his French and German compatriots. 40% of London is now foreign born, and the birth rates of immigrants far exceed those of native Brits. It stands to reason Progressives are producing new voters at a far faster rate, than Populists.
Or maybe the ghosts of Thatcher and Kohl will save Western Europe from Progressives hellbent on the destruction of Western values that demand equal rights for women, Jews and the LGBTQ community. And most importantly, the protection of children, at all costs. Perhaps by the end of the decade, Farage is running England, the AfD will hold the most seats Germany and a LePen disciple will at the helm in France.
More likely, Progressives will realize, a la Denmark, they can support open borders or hold power, but they can no longer do both. Faced with with such a dilemma, ultimately, Progressives will pick power every day of the week, and twice on Sunday.
If Starmer doesn't do something now to stop, or drastically slow, the numbers of illegals entering the country and stop the crime by illegals, he and his party are done for. And he has to stop the arrest of UK citizens speaking and protesting against illegals. So far, it looks like Starmer and his party have gone mad and lost their way.
Starmer's unpopularity is concerning, in that he has largely taken the path of avoiding moving further left on major issues like immigration, and instead tried acknowledging the concerns that are fueling right-populism, and pushing for centrist solutions. Andrew Sullivan did a good job of summarizing a lot of them (although he is also a critic of the Starmer government):
"Higher standards for English fluency, longer waits to apply for citizenship, a tougher values test, a longer period before you can stay indefinitely, and lower migration levels over the course of five years."
These are all liberal nationalist policies that take people's concerns about immigration seriously, without going full-on "throw them all out and stop bringing any in" and without engaging in xenophobia. My hope is that Starmer simply hasn't executed them well enough, not that they are simply being rejected in favor of pure xenophobic chauvinism.
But ultimately it's possible that what we could be seeing, unfortunately, is that we are simply regressing back to the illiberal attitudes and social trends of the interwar years. Hopefully not. Because we all know how that ended. One hopes that this time millions don't have to die and half the world doesn't have to come under the shadow of authoritarian governments preaching gospels about the national 'master race' before it becomes obvious why such illiberal ideas are bad ones.
I could not believe it either that systemic child rape was being swept under the rug. I also could not believe that progressives were not screaming about this after all the uproar of the “me too” culture. I don’t think there is much the British ruling class can do to redeem themselves if they do not address this and the reasons behind it
This is pretty unconvincing support of Starmer, basically reject the reform party, stick together and be optimistic about the economic future. She lists the bad things that have happened over the last few weeks and things that happened to the middle class and instead of making these foundational they were largely ignored as well as the legitimate grievances of the people supporting the reform party. Now I am not really familiar with the political issues in Great Britain except at a very high level but at the very high level Starmer’s speach sounds a bit like what I have heard in liberal/ progressive speaches. In the US and those fell very flat with the working people.
Gah. This is awful. Labour makes the Democrats look good and the Tories do the same for the GOPe. Delusional hack didn't notice that Stamer's landslide attracted fewer votes than Cobryn's wipeout. Heck of a job winning back the working class. Memo to TLP. Don't take advice from these fools.
Stop with the personal insults or you will be blocked. Fine to disagree but do it in a respectful manner.
Any saving of Great Britain REQUIRES power going to the national populists... aka the center working and middle class... and taken away from the upper class elites.
Yes, but populism and nationalism must also be disciplined by the guard-rails of liberalism. (as in 'liberal democratic norms', not as in progressivism)
Indefinitely pushing in the direction of right-wing populism without any guiding liberal principles has never worked out well for anyone, the working and middle classes most of all. Last time Europe tried it, it resulted in two World Wars, the decimation of every Western country sans the U.S., and the gruesome deaths of millions of people.
I don't think that's something that will be of any benefit to the working or middle class.
And the French Revolution is another good example of populism going very wrong . And that did not even require a head of state to make it happen That doesn’t mean the underclass did not have very legitimate grievances, they did but grievances not addressed and then exploited for power with no legal restraints and personal liberties respected ends badly
I have a very hard time even attempting to understand politics from a country that arrests 30 people a day because their speech has offended someone. People here who have business in England have to be careful of what they say on Twitter here because they could get arrested there.
Sounds like the working class in England has no party to represent their interests. Glad we revolted from that poxy island.
The lack of free speech is very disconcerting , but it pales in comparison to tolerance for the systematic rape of children. The West is only 15% of the world's population. Until recently we had very specific beliefs that separate us from the other 7 billion people on the planet.
In the West, first and foremost, we protect women and children, at all costs. That is not the case in most of the rest of the world, even if other non Western nations bother to pay lip service to the idea. We demand equal rights for all. Women are not chattel. Jews, historically chastised and abused all over the globe, have been safer in the US than anywhere else, but Israel. The LGBTQ community does not fear physical attack or a lack of rights in the West.
Until recently, free speech, unknown in the vast majority of the rest of the world, was a cornerstone of Western values. Now as the mess in England clearly demonstrates, Western values are at risk of disappearing. If they do so, at the alter of multiculturalism, they will not be returning anytime soon, anywhere on the planet.
This issue (tiring a blind eye to systemic issues of child rape) more than any really turns me off to the British ruling class.
The notion that England must be saved from Populists, is sadly amusing to anyone who has watched the changes in the nation over the last few decades. More than a decade ago, we arrived in London to stories of an English Judge who refused to imprison a newly arrived Muslim migrant for raping a 13 year old girl, because the migrant was unaware sex with children was a crime.
I remember it vividly because I did not believe it, when we first heard the story. We were living in CA at the time, and I remember thinking not even San Francisco lunatics would abide such a travesty. This was long before there was any reporting on the grooming gangs and mass rape of poor English girls by Pakistani men or Brits watched Jews executed on their streets, on the most sacred Jewish day of the year.
Starmer has an 18% approval rate. More than 80% of English voters want him gone. Some diseases are more popular. The last time Western voters had that much buyer's remorse, Biden was sitting in the WH and 5-10K migrants a day had been streaming across the Texas border, for the better part of 2 years.
Perhaps Starmer will limp along with his French and German compatriots. 40% of London is now foreign born, and the birth rates of immigrants far exceed those of native Brits. It stands to reason Progressives are producing new voters at a far faster rate, than Populists.
Or maybe the ghosts of Thatcher and Kohl will save Western Europe from Progressives hellbent on the destruction of Western values that demand equal rights for women, Jews and the LGBTQ community. And most importantly, the protection of children, at all costs. Perhaps by the end of the decade, Farage is running England, the AfD will hold the most seats Germany and a LePen disciple will at the helm in France.
More likely, Progressives will realize, a la Denmark, they can support open borders or hold power, but they can no longer do both. Faced with with such a dilemma, ultimately, Progressives will pick power every day of the week, and twice on Sunday.
If Starmer doesn't do something now to stop, or drastically slow, the numbers of illegals entering the country and stop the crime by illegals, he and his party are done for. And he has to stop the arrest of UK citizens speaking and protesting against illegals. So far, it looks like Starmer and his party have gone mad and lost their way.
Starmer's unpopularity is concerning, in that he has largely taken the path of avoiding moving further left on major issues like immigration, and instead tried acknowledging the concerns that are fueling right-populism, and pushing for centrist solutions. Andrew Sullivan did a good job of summarizing a lot of them (although he is also a critic of the Starmer government):
"Higher standards for English fluency, longer waits to apply for citizenship, a tougher values test, a longer period before you can stay indefinitely, and lower migration levels over the course of five years."
These are all liberal nationalist policies that take people's concerns about immigration seriously, without going full-on "throw them all out and stop bringing any in" and without engaging in xenophobia. My hope is that Starmer simply hasn't executed them well enough, not that they are simply being rejected in favor of pure xenophobic chauvinism.
But ultimately it's possible that what we could be seeing, unfortunately, is that we are simply regressing back to the illiberal attitudes and social trends of the interwar years. Hopefully not. Because we all know how that ended. One hopes that this time millions don't have to die and half the world doesn't have to come under the shadow of authoritarian governments preaching gospels about the national 'master race' before it becomes obvious why such illiberal ideas are bad ones.
I could not believe it either that systemic child rape was being swept under the rug. I also could not believe that progressives were not screaming about this after all the uproar of the “me too” culture. I don’t think there is much the British ruling class can do to redeem themselves if they do not address this and the reasons behind it